We always knew that that the Democrats just wanted to raise taxes

From The Caucus blog of :

Cantor Quits Biden’s Debt Ceiling Talks

By Jennifer Steinhauer, June 23, 2011, 11:04 am

House Majority Leader Eric Cantor, Republican of Virginia, said Thursday that he was quitting  the debt ceiling negotiations being led by Vice President Joseph R. Biden Jr. because of an impasse over the role of taxes in any final deal.

“I believe that we have identified trillions in spending cuts, and to date, we have established a blueprint that could institute the fiscal reforms needed to start getting our fiscal house in order,” Mr. Cantor said in a prepared statement.

“That said, each side came into these talks with certain orders, and as it stands the Democrats continue to insist that any deal must include tax increases. There is not support in the House for a tax increase, and I don’t believe now is the time to raise taxes in light of our current economic situation. Regardless of the progress that has been made, the tax issue must be resolved before discussions can continue.”

Much more at the link.

We always knew that the Democrats wanted to increase taxes, because they want to spend more money. Well, that’s the wrong thing to do, and the Republicans should hold firm: no tax increases in the debt ceiling increase, or there will be no debt ceiling increase. Then, after spending is cut, it will be reasonable to consider tax increases, to reduce the debt.

But if tax increases are part of the original package, it will mean that spending will be higher. The Democrats want to keep on just doing business as usual, but that’s how we got into this mess in the first place.

20 Comments

  1. “Then, after spending is cut, it will be reasonable to consider tax increases, to reduce the debt. ”

    Sorry Dana but you are wrong. There is nothing reasonable for raising taxes. That always results in more spending. I find it hard to raise taxes for anyting other than a national emergency. Taxes are fine where thyey are. Not too high and not too low. The problem is we seem to have an “element” who believes that not all Americans should pay taxes (federal). They seem to believe that 47% should be tax exempt. Sorry, if you have the right to vote, you have the responsability to pay taxes. Last year I payed over $114,000 in ( just ) fedeal tax. I get one vote. So does some asshole in Germantown who pays zero! You may hate me for saying it but this BLOWS. I pay the taxes and some dick-head gets to invalidate my vote. And if he has a brother, they win. I know, fuck me.

  2. The good news is that wilst I’m ranting here, I actually found a good location in Huntingdon Valley to open an Italian market (complete with HOAGIES). In the Beth Ayres Shopping Center there is a spot. Just a little spot (1200 SF). But I think I could do a thing there. June is not ” so on board’. yet! She does not want me to “do” anything new. But I gotta! It’s in my f’in blood. I could do this thing for about 250 grand. I may even import some of those Portugese cheeses and meats. Who knows?

    Hoagie knows.

  3. Sounds like a perfect place for a Grand Opening Party! But, do you have anything without rotten, sour, clabbered milk cheese on it?

    We could even contribute special sandwich recipes! You could have the Dana Special: Pastrami, brown mustard, banana peppers and sauerkraut on toasted pumpernickel bread!

    We’re gonna need a Yorkshire Delight, too, as well as a Hitchcock BBQ.

    And you could even have Blubonnet margerine. :)

  4. “Hitchcock BBQ” is kinda like “Efficient Bureaucracy” if ya know what I mean. How bout Lebanon Balogna, hard salami, peppered beef, turkey, lettuce, onion, jalapenos, shrooms, oregano, spicy horseradish mustard on dark Bavarian rye?

  5. Hoagie wrote:

    “Then, after spending is cut, it will be reasonable to consider tax increases, to reduce the debt. ”

    Sorry Dana but you are wrong. There is nothing reasonable for raising taxes. That always results in more spending. I find it hard to raise taxes for anyting other than a national emergency.

    Actually, I think it is approaching a national emergency; we aren’t quite there yet. However, I think that it is reasonable to start paying down the debt we have run up; that money was spent on us, so we should be the ones to pay it back.

    But your concern is why I say that spending has to be cut, and cut drastically, first. Once we see that spending really has been cut, then taxes can be raised solely to work on the debt.

    And I also agree: if taxes are raised, they should be raised on everybody.

  6. The US has the second-highest corporate tax rate in the world. Cut that tax-rate — and the over-regulation — and businesses will BOOM, creating a much higher tax revenue out of the lower tax rate. Businesses become more profitable, retirement plans generate higher rates of return, more employees have jobs and better jobs, greater income growth for the people and greater tax revenue for the government.

    Raise the tax rates and generate less tax revenue, lose jobs, send more businesses into bankruptcy, do great harm to poor and middle class.

    No, there is no need to raise tax rates when lowering them will generate more tax revenue.

  7. It’s all food Dana. 100% food. I can do this thing and do it well. Yes, it is food “from the world” but none the less, food. Now if I should or should not do it……tell me.. I’m hyped, ready, gnawing at the bit. June says “no” (in capital letters). I want to do this business, waddaythink?

  8. What do I think? John, it’s what you do! If you are getting hyped up for this, it’s because you are a businessman, this is the business you know and love, and you can’t just turn it off. Maybe Mrs C doesn’t want the stress and the work and the time involved in this, and that always has to be considered, but the real question isn’t should you do this, but could you not do it?

  9. No, my freind. There is no way I can’t do this little business. Matter of fact, June is sitting here next to me telling me “go”. So I must assume between You and June that I MUST open this thing? Absolutely! It’s a done deal. Hell, I can’t say no to June can I? Well I cvould but then I’d never get laid again. (She’s stil here). Thank you, you made my day, perhaps my year.

  10. The US has the second-highest corporate tax rate in the world.

    Wrong.

    The U.S. corporate tax burden is smaller than average for developed countries.[1] Corporations in 19 of the member states of the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development paid 16.1 percent of their profits in taxes between 2000 and 2005, on average, while corporations in the United States paid 13.4 percent.

    That was in 2008. Current EFFECTIVE corporate tax rates for the EU are here.

    This is, of course, a lie based on the deliberate confusion of the nominal corporate tax rate with the effective tax rate – what is actually paid. Go and take a look at figure 2.7 there.

    In actual fact the US has the lowest corporate taxation in the West as a % of GDP.

    Cut that tax-rate — and the over-regulation — and businesses will BOOM, creating a much higher tax revenue out of the lower tax rate.

    Wrong.

    Companies are hoarding a record amount of cash as fears of another Lehman-like credit crisis, weak demand and a lack of incentives from the Obama Administration cause chief executives to choose a negative real return on their money over hiring workers or building a new plant.

    The current members of the S&P 500 [.SPX 1283.50 -3.64 (-0.28%) ] are sitting on about $800 billion in cash and cash equivalents, the most ever, according to data by Birinyi Associates, even as the unemployment rate has ticked back above 9 percent. Most of this cash and cash equivalents are likely yielding at or below the current 3.6 percent annual rate of inflation, giving it a negative real return.

    So even with taxes as they are corporations are still not investing a huge wad of cash. Lowering corporate taxes still further (and they are already the lowest they’ve been since 1950) will NOT induce them to invest SINCE THEY ARE ALREADY SITTING ON HUGE RESERVES. It will simply increase that cash buffer.

    What will induce them to invest is offering a chance of a real return on their money – which means getting demand going again.

    Once again, this is a demand-driven recession. And once again pro-banker, JH, propaganda is being treated as truthful.

    [retrieved from moderation - pH]

  11. Dana, I’d like to call you this weekend. I need some input on cheeses and meats from your perspective. Plus, I’d like to hear your voice again.

  12. BTW Dana, I’m throwing a little get-to-gether on the fourth of July and I’d like to extend a “Hoagie” welcome to all you guys. I know Pho is too far away but it would be cool to see him also. A tad of food, a tad of booze and a tad of freindship. We don’t even have to talk politics, just drink and explode fireworks. I will have some of my Mason friends as well as some (crazy) Sweedeborgins here but you might actually like them. Plus, I may have a senator (and wife) and a few crazy-assed doctors. Bring a swimsuit for the pool, we provide the towels, and a healthy appetite for food an spirits. Nothing else required.

  13. “No, there is no need to raise tax rates when lowering them will generate more tax revenue.”

    Except that is not what happened during Bush-43. In fact , revenue dipped in the 2002-2006 time frame, following the Bush tax cuts, and the deficit ballooned. When are you going to quit making stuff up, John?

    Not only that, during the Clinton years, when there was a tax increase on the wealthy, revenues increased in the 1993-2001 time period, and the deficits were turned into a surplus.

    So John, you have it all wrong!!! Now are you going to admit that you were wrong, John? Of course not, since you are never wrong, in your own mind!

  14. “Companies are hoarding a record amount of cash as fears of another Lehman-like credit crisis, weak demand and a lack of incentives from the Obama Administration cause chief executives to choose a negative real return on their money over hiring workers or building a new plant.”

    I cannot prove it, but I believe that corporations are withholding investment in our economy as a political move aimed at defeating Obama in 2012. If this tactic works, and it very well might, the American worker, the American middle class, the American poor, will suffer worse than ever, and we will have chaos in our city streets, in my view.

    And by the way, PiaToR, please do not inundate these Righties with the facts about their sacred cow, taxes, since it is not good for their mental health. Nevertheless, they will continue to cling to their beliefs, no matter what. Perish the thought that they should get the Presidency back in 2012!

  15. Hoagie wrote:

    Dana, I’d like to call you this weekend. I need some input on cheeses and meats from your perspective. Plus, I’d like to hear your voice again.

    Go for it. Do you still have my number, or do I need to e-mail it to you again?

  16. Perry says,

    I cannot prove it, but I believe that corporations are withholding investment in our economy as a political move aimed at defeating Obama in 2012.

    Perry, do a quick check on which companies and which industries are hoarding cash. In an October 2010 article I just read technology and pharmaceuticals are sitting on the most cash. In the last 5 years those 2 industries have given more money to democrats than republicans. There are stats on that site for you to use as you see fit but they do not support your above contention.

    http://www.opensecrets.org/overview/industries.php

  17. You don’t understand, jcw. Companies are intentionally trying to destroy the Blessed One’s presidency because they are run by a bunch of anti-patriotic racist rich white guys. The failed economy has nothing to do with the Blessed One’s failed redistributionist socialist anti-business class-warfare agenda and everything to do with everyone hating the Blessed One because the Blessed One is half white, part black, part Ishmaelean.

  18. “Perry says,

    I cannot prove it, but I believe that corporations are withholding investment in our economy as a political move aimed at defeating Obama in 2012.

    Perry, do a quick check on which companies and which industries are hoarding cash. In an October 2010 article I just read technology and pharmaceuticals are sitting on the most cash. In the last 5 years those 2 industries have given more money to democrats than republicans. There are stats on that site for you to use as you see fit but they do not support your above contention.

    http://www.opensecrets.org/overview/industries.php

    Good point and good cite, jcw, although this does not necessarily refute my suspicion, but it does call it to question. That cite definitely merits a bookmark; I was unaware of it.

  19. Perry wrote:

    I cannot prove it, but I believe that corporations are withholding investment in our economy as a political move aimed at defeating Obama in 2012. If this tactic works, and it very well might, the American worker, the American middle class, the American poor, will suffer worse than ever, and we will have chaos in our city streets, in my view.

    Well, our Kiwi Kommenter has said that our economic problems are due to low demand, so he will be disagreeing with you. After all, why should corporations invest in things for which they see no demand?

    But, more broadly speaking, corporations exist to make a profit for themselves and their shareholders. If they see an opportunity to make a reasonable profit at an acceptable risk, they will make the necessary investments; they might wind up right, or they might wind up wrong. And if corporations are “withholding investment,” it is because they don’t see (speaking overall) the opportunity to make reasonable levels of profit at acceptable levels of risk. To many corporations, yes, President Obama and the Democrats are just bad for business.

    However, if you really believe that corporations are doing this to defeat President Obama, perhaps you ought to consider voting Republican! After all, if your suspicions are correct, once President Obama and the Democrats are defeated, we will see a major surge in investment and business growth, which will wind up providing millions and millions of jobs! Since it is those jobs you see as most important, you really have no choice if you are going to be logically consistent: you must vote Republican! :)

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